Underated cards

[headswillroll]

Thank you for the correction, I thought it was Jeff and not Zodo. Any input to the list?



Headswillroll

[jamesmcmurray]

Remove 5 can be amazing in specific decks. Break Glass is useful for all decks, assuming your opponent lets you trigger it. They're both great cards with their own niche.

[prowler7]

jamesmcmurray said:

Remove 5 can be amazing in specific decks. Break Glass is useful for all decks, assuming your opponent lets you trigger it. They're both great cards with their own niche.

I have to disagree with you there, James. Break Glass CAN be usefull, and is generally MORE usefull than Remove 5 unless a deck is made specifically for that. However, Break Glass is a desperation card, played because your deck isnt working correctly and your opponent has caught you with your pants down. If your deck is properly built, you shouldnt ever need it.

[jamesmcmurray]

We may have to agree to disagree then. I consider Break Glass part of what makes my deck work, right alongside the focuses, alertnesses, police, etc. It's not a desperation measure, it's a one-shot catch-all tool.

Do you consider Conner's new Master Focus a desperation card or a tool to ensure your deck works properly? If it's a tool, why isn't Break Glass? If it's a desperation measure, how can one expect their deck to work properly without cards like Focus and Alertness??

[prowler7]

jamesmcmurray said:

We may have to agree to disagree then. I consider Break Glass part of what makes my deck work, right alongside the focuses, alertnesses, police, etc. It's not a desperation measure, it's a one-shot catch-all tool.

Do you consider Conner's new Master Focus a desperation card or a tool to ensure your deck works properly? If it's a tool, why isn't Break Glass? If it's a desperation measure, how can one expect their deck to work properly without cards like Focus and Alertness??

So when you play "Break Glass" you dont remove it from the game, and get to use it over and over again just like those Focus & Alertness? If thats the case, then I stand corrected, it is a GREAT card. If not, then my point is made.

[jamesmcmurray]

What does it matter whether it gets removed from the game or not? An ephemeral tool is still a tool. In this instance, BG is a much more potent tool than alertness or focus, and has the balancing factor of requiring a pregame slot and removal from the game.

To rephrase the question to match the new information:

Do you consider Divine Intervention a desperation card or a tool to ensure your deck works properly? If it's a tool, why isn't Break Glass? If it's a desperation measure, how can one expect their deck to work properly without the ability to handle quickenings or other pregames that ruin it's day?

[prowler7]

jamesmcmurray said:

What does it matter whether it gets removed from the game or not? An ephemeral tool is still a tool. In this instance, BG is a much more potent tool than alertness or focus, and has the balancing factor of requiring a pregame slot and removal from the game.

To rephrase the question to match the new information:

Do you consider Divine Intervention a desperation card or a tool to ensure your deck works properly? If it's a tool, why isn't Break Glass? If it's a desperation measure, how can one expect their deck to work properly without the ability to handle quickenings or other pregames that ruin it's day?

You stated that you build your deck around the ability to use Break Glass and that it is a vital component. If your vital deck component is composed of a 1 use card, what are you gonna do when your opponent uses that same device you prevented ONCE four or five more times? I am guessing that you may only have 2 Alertness in your deck. So now you have saved your neck 3 times (if you got those Alertness consecutively, which is unlikely), but here comes that same combo 2 or 3 more times and now you have no way of stopping it. I would rather have toolbox cards I can count on having EVERY TURN. Thanks to 2ed, the BEST toolbox cards cycle themselves (good job guys, that was genius).

Divine Intervention is really only usefull if you KNOW your opponents all play a particular Q that can break your deck (and if thats the case, why play that deck?). Otherwise, what else are you using the card for? Thier rip? Thier Break Glass? What if THIER deck isnt built around the absolute need for those cards? What if thier deck doesnt even HAVE those cards? Now you have a useless toolbox card sitting in your deck taking up room.

[jamesmcmurray]

What I stated was that "I consider Break Glass part of what makes my deck work, right alongside the focuses, alertnesses, police, etc." that's far from "absolute need." If you're going to argue against what I say, please at least argue against what I actually say.

Break Glass is an excellent consistency helper. If you see a unblockable/undodgeable power blow coming but didn't draw your alertness, you break glass. If you did draw all three of your alertnesses but no focuses and they play an Honor Bound: Break Glass. If you didn't draw a Concentration (or is it Discipline?) and they drop a Ped: Hidden... Break Glass.

I have never built a deck around using Break Glass. Nor did I ever say that I did. Perhaps you stopped reading my statement at the comma?

as for divine Intervention: are you honestly saying their deck isn't going to play any pregames you can DI? I suppose perhaps if everyone is new, but maybe we just have different metagames. The people I play with have powerful cards and like to use them.

[prowler7]

Tell you what, I cant construct a reply that wont get me warned, so I will abstain from any further comment. I dont want to end up like Headswillroll.....

The terms of use have really cracked down on constructive criticism. ;D

The one answer I CAN give civilly is this -
My opponents generally DONT have any pregames I care enough to DI instead of playing my deck according to its theme.

[jamesmcmurray]

The forum rules say absolutely nothing that prevents constructive criticism. I'd even go so far as to say that if your criticism breaks the rules, it was not of the constructive variety to begin with.

Looks like we're at that "agree to disagree" place I predicted. Apparently our disparate personal opinions and metagames combine to make me feel that BG is a tool and you feel it's a desperation measure for poorly designed decks. It's not like those terms can be objectively defined here, so it's no big deal.

[silas73]

As for underated cards, I would go with the Kern persona.

The Remove 5 A&T can be seen as a desperation tool but it can be very effective in preventing that end of game headshot. It does not tell you to reshuffle your endurance after searching, (unless I missed an errata) hence every time I've seen it used it is when a headshot is coming, you search the top of your endurance and remove anything that won't block the headshot. Not 100% but can work more often than you might think.

[dbaker]

I think a good card is the Arms and Tactics Keep cards from an exertion. If you play Kurgan and play a bloodlust. Keep the good cards(after playing the attacks) and put them in your hand.

[jamesmcmurray]

The keep exertion is a staple in my Katana decks and decks using the Katana Q.

[dbaker]

I was going thru some cards last friday to make my deck I was going to play and I came accross the Overextended Attack. At first glance I asked myself "self why would anyone put an attack like that in there deck?" A light bulb went off in my head. I always play the Circle location. I don't include dodges in most of my decks. So free power blows, it is a great card. It worked very well in my Hyde deck.

Overextended Attack- You may make a 0-card Exertion to make this attack a power blow. Your opponents next attack during his turn is undodgeable.

[jamesmcmurray]

Overextended Attack is great. I use the heck out of it with Cassandra. The deck's got enough gaurds and alertnesses that the drawback is mostly nonexistent.